The [REFACTORED] Podcast

A casual, ongoing conversation between two technology leaders with Chris Tonkinson and Frank Koehl.


React.js, SCSS, Big-O, Kubernetes, TLS.
The guys have cut and run CAT5 through
plenum, built and racked servers, found
SQL Server performance bottlenecks, and
written a hell of a lot of good software.


From Enterprise to small business, the
guys have managed and built teams for
years; serial entrepreneurs with strong
cross-functional acumen and a knack for
translating between "geek" and "human."


Frank brings the energetic snark. Chris
brings the cranky optimism. Together,
they can barely get through a single show
without devolving into petty ad-hominem
attacks and, often, childish sound effects.

Recent Episodes

Refactored 074: "Use the Dang Frameworks"

Wherein the guys implement a stack to keep track of all the sidebars.

published Aug 2, 2022
Show Notes

  • Chris is totally geeking out about the images released from the James Webb Space Telescope and then goes on a tangent about proving Einstein right (frame-dragging, gravitational redshift and lensing, gravitational waves, …).
  • Frank claims there are people out there ignoring all the benefits frameworks provide, like…
  • Chris goes on a rant about pour over coffee and how he just wants machines to do all the work. Then goes on a rant about why typing is good for the frontend but not the database.
  • Key phrases/themes for this week: NIH and YAGNI.
  • The guys fight (a little) about wireframing and prototyping.
  • Feedback: Anon says, “I have a department which I am dependent upon that is always dealing with emergencies…” and boy, oh boy, does it sound like Anon is in a pickle. Yikes.
  • … and much more!

Refactored 073: "Discoverability vs Expressiveness"

Wherein the guys nerd fight, but agree on spaces over tabs and vim over emacs.

published Jul 19, 2022
Show Notes

  • Chris likes DistroTube’s video about Vim where he argues (counterintuitively) that Vim is a better UX than a GUI editor.
  • Is it worth it to learn the arcane sorceries of a terminal editor? The guys debate. Chris says yea, Frank says nay.
  • Vim vs Visual Studio is a great case study to the broader Linux vs Fisher Price OS Winders debate.
  • The guys like PowerShell (except the syntax) and Desired State Configuration (DSC) and SCCM Microsoft Endpoint Manger (MEM) are brought up for some reason.
  • Some time is spent comparing Excel vs Google Docs vs sc.
  • … and much more!

Refactored 072: "Rules of the Road"

Wherein Chris is undercover law enforcement and Frank is a consummate demotivator.

published Jun 28, 2022
Show Notes

  • Frank runs through the “Rules of the Road” (guidelines for fostering heatlhy creative discussion):
    1. Reserve judgement
    2. Raise alternatives, not protests
    3. You are not your ideas
    4. Always converse at a round table
  • The guys agree - leaders should speak last.
  • Feedback: Dave asks, “What are your suggestions for building a sense of “team” with everyone working remotely?
  • The pick of the week is demotivational material by Despair. Some of our favorites:
    • Motivation — If a pretty poster and a cute saying are all it takes to motivate you, you probably have a very easy job. The kind robots will be doing soon.
    • Teamwork — Because none of us is as dumb as all of us.
    • Consulting — If you’re not part of the solution, there’s good money to be made prolonging the problem.
  • … and much more!

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